Is Daz3D Centaur 7/8 able to be animated?
ToBoldlyGo
Posts: 21
Apologies for my ignorance. The centaur figures from earlier Daz generations seemed to me (never having owned one, or at least used one if my memory is failing) to be more "artistic additions" to existing figures instead of full fledged figures. Either conforming parts, or I suppose geografts, could be used to add the additional components. I don't see how a 4-limbed bipedal figure can become a 6-limbed quadraped without some sort of significant jiggery-pokery. It would imply, possibly, that the Gen 7/8 figures actually have 6 limbs... but two are normally ignored??? Or the 7/8 mesh is tortured into the more complex form (at the cost of compatability with other content) and then re-rigged? Presumably all limbs are posable, but is there some way to animate walking, running, etc? What content can be used meant for bipedal figures? Can one put boots on the centaur, etc., etc.??? Enquiring minds want to know.
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The centaur legs and body are a geograft, which means that they are controlled separately. You would animate the human part using human controls, and the centaur part using centaur controls, but they are very much integrated physically, and you changes to one will affect the other when appropriate.
As far as whether you can use bipedal clothing and accessories, the answer is a resounding “kiiiiiiiinda?”.
Pony Steps
It took a LOT of futzing around with two additional, invisible G8Fs lined up with the horse legs to make the skates and knee pads (which were actually part of a pair of pants rather than their own accessories) to make them look even as right as they do there, and I’m still not very happy with it.
Thanks Gordig, I think you covered my basic questions as well as possible. Your image looks great, but you have conveyed the difficulty acheiving it in a still image, which means animation would be all the harder to achieve (for your kind of example). My question about boots were a stretch to see just how far compatability went, my own intentions are more in the fantasy vein. I guess the situation might be summed up "your milage may vary?" My primary interest is animation, so I'm biased towards thinking it's not a satisfactory centaur until you can get it to charge at you in all its semi-equine glory. I guess even if a vendor wanted to make some sort of walk/run cycle it would require accessing the two different control sets and wouldn't be a single operation. I wonder if grafting a human portion onto a version of the Daz Horse might have been the way to go for that kind of result (any interested Daz artists feel free to apply any suggestions to the Daz Centaur 9!)
I should add that the centaur geograft can take horse poses, so if there are horse aniblocks or other animations, I see no reason to think those wouldn’t work as well. Horse poses can distort the human transition, but I’m pretty sure there are workarounds for that that I just haven’t tried yet.
I’ve also given thought to experimenting with a projection morph that would allow one to use human clothes on a centaur with less fiddling, although I haven’t entirely worked out the logistics yet.
As for animation, that is completely up to you. As long as a part is rigged, it can be animated. Even props can be animated. Now if you are looking for premade animations, that is a whole other story.
Michael & Gordig, yes, aniblocks or other pre-made ways to animate a common process, is what I had in mind. Hand-animating a figure that (if I understand things right) is more or less rigged as a human on its front legs and a horse on its rear legs seems daughting. Standing, to walk, to canter, to run, etc. Seems like a whole lot of work. I prefer that someone else invent the wheel and I just keep buying versions of it. It would be nice if it were 100% compatible with horse animations, since I would guess that's a broder market, but maybe nobody has filled that niche yet (I haven't went searching for horse aniblocks, etc., and at least don't remember them). I greatly appreciate all your input, and one of the key points is knowing that the whole figure is rigged properly. Centaurs are an undiscovered continent of the Dazosphere to me, and I actually haven't worked with horses either.
Actually, from the (human) waist down, Daz centaurs are functionally identical to Daz Horse 2, which is why you can use horse materials, poses, etc. with them. The human legs disappear into the geograft, and the horse legs, both fore and hind, behave like horse legs should, down to having bones and joints that human legs don’t.
I do a fair amount of centaur renders, so I’m happy to help if you have questions.
Gordig, thank you for your kind offer which I may take you up on it later if I find a need. I was considering buying the Centaur 8 series during the recent sale where you got a big discount on multiple Pro bundles. But my concerns over functionality, overall lack of time to process the purchases (no internet in my rural area unless I went satellite, and limited time at wifi spots), and a bit of bad weather (so even less time than I hoped for) caused me to miss that sale altogether (just like my bad luck wiped out my chance over the X-Mas/New Years sale). With Genesis 9 coming in 2020 I may wait until I see if there is a new Centaur version out (but I usually backfill any base models and unique creatures, etc.). I've had to drop out of my dabbling in Daz CG for a few years for a number of external reasons. Seems like I'm coming back in just in time to buy every major product over again (again!). It would be nice to try to master at least one full generation of tools before the next rolls out (pretty sure that's on my bucket list), but I keep perpetually playing catch-up. Maybe after Genesis 10 Daz will follow Microsoft's lead and stop releasing new versions!
Its excellent to know the Centaurs are compatible with the Daz Horse 2 in so many ways, exactly as I hoped. I have ran across some Horse 2 animations while plowing through the store today, so that helps. I like the Swiss Army Knife approach, having multiple uses for a given item. Now we just have to convince the morph and texture conversion vendors to pony up for some cross-generation Centaur products..
I don’t think the centaurs were included in any of the pro bundle sales, if that makes you feel any better. There’s no guarantee that Genesis 9 is coming this year, although that seems likely; all we were ever told for sure was that it wasn’t coming in 2019. Even if it does come, though, centaurs will be a couple years behind, and both the G3 and G8 centaurs will still be quite usable in the meantime. You don’t HAVE to update to the latest model if the old one works for you.
oh I got them dirt cheap a couple weeks ago in one ...
I thought I saw a Pro Bundle sale yesterday, and if you bought three it was like 80% off or something (I don't think I actually clicked on it, so there may have been something I missed, like only applying to certain bundles). But I ran out of time and it was not quite worth delaying getting home until the conditions were icy instead of just slick. It was kind of relaxing to take a few years off from buying here as the sales could get quite nerve wracking: just what would I see for prices when I checked my cart, would the server stop responding just before I was ready to check out, would McDonald's amazingly slow internet go down, would I look up and see a parking lot covered with snow, etc.? I actually had to abandon my vehicle on the side of the road one night when it couldn't make it up an icy hill due to the CUV's "traction control", when I missed the important fact that there was freezing rain outside, The guy behind me gave me a lift and had no problems in a FWD car. But briefly I was considered an honorary member of the McDonald's staff (i.e., one of the few people who would stop there while the highway next to it was being redone for half the year).
Anyway, my point was (for 5-7 figures) I would finally get a full collection of "basic"+"necessary" (figure/texture/clothing/pose converters, muscle morphs, JCMs, etc.) items (i.e., vendors got around to releasing them) when the next generation would come out and I would start the process again. Don't get me wrong, its also an embarasment of riches because most often the content was better than had come previously. So, I'm in no hurry, I wouldn't mind seeing 4-5 years behind generations, but I am probably in the minority.
As regarding the next generation release, the thread I saw does imply at earliest 2020:
https://www.daz3d.com/forums/discussion/266736/genesis-9-delayed-until-at-least-2020-will-you-be-buying-it/p1
But if history is any indicator, I no doubt will buy Centaur 7-8 at some point. Whether I need it or not, as long as its on sale!!! Here I am again, snow starting outside, slowly freezing to death in a McDonald's after a library has closed trying to get a purchase completed. Is there a 12-step program for Daz content? Since Wendy joined the conversation, she may have to take my cats if I don't make it. Good thing she LUVS cats, right?