3Delight has that Iray doesn't?
Daz 3D Forums > General > The Commons>3Delight has that Iray doesn't?
3Delight has that Iray doesn't?
Marshian
Posts: 1,465
in The Commons
I'm cooking up some new product ideas. Besides the render speed and these qualities:
- The ability to control occlusion level
- Turn off cast shadows
- Use grass, rock, and other specialty shaders
- Position your distant lights by “looking through”
- Use skydomes
What main things can 3Delight do that Iray can't?
Would anyone find an Iray to 3Delight shader set useful?
thx!
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Comments
You can still look through distant lights in IRay. The only "sort of distant light" where this is not obvious is the Sun light, and this can be done by creating a camera and placing it in the sun node.
You might want to add Toon Shaders to your list, these only really work well in 3DL. Also certain speciality cameras (look at AoA camera for examples).
Yes there are still a lot of uses for 3Dl and there is an inscreasing number of products that are only Iray.
However, you should also be aware that, while it may not be perfect, Esmay has written a script to convert Iray to 3Dl: http://www.daz3d.com/forums/discussion/139326/irayto3delight-conversion-script#latest
I won't use iray - its glacially slow on my AMD system.. (notwithstanding the fact that to upgrade to use it would cost more than I can afford to pay for half decent setup) any tweaks to 3dlight would be very well received here, especially a settings converter...
While I will never have any use for 3Delight, there are probably a few that would benefit from a shader converter. If you're looking for product ideas, looking thru your store, I would love something like UltruMarine for Iray.
Light control... you can control light very different in 3DL compared to Iray - this includes things like shadow controls and how far your light will go at what strength.
I also still use both render engines. Admitted, I use Iray a lot more than I use 3DL, but after the "ah, shiny!" phase of Iray, I also use 3DL more often again, which I didn't thought possible after really liking Iray's results.
The Iray to 3DL conversion tool, yes,I would buy that. I still have some 3DL shaders whislisted.
But I don't know how a hndful of people here will translate into real sales numbers - there are a lot of new users who never tried 3DL. It would probably need something along the line of "The beautiful world of 3Delight" free Tutorial or something like that to alert people on how to use 3DL...
I have seen more than one person wishing for an Iray to 3Delight shader...
And if there was a way to convert iray environment light settings, well...
Displacement is great in 3Delight, even low res meshes can get really good displacement results. Iray needs a high res model to get good displacement results so it's sort of worthless in Iray.
Some ideas I hadn't thought of here. Thanks so much for the input//and keep it coming if you see more to put in.
"Something wonderful is about to happen" for any of you that only use 3Delight! I'm within a day or two of submitting it for review and testing. It will take 2 weeks to a month to be released after that. If it goes through testing OK I'll post some promos here.
That sounds exciting! Will continue to think on it for sure.
I switched to Iray when it came out but have been doing the more of my renders in 3DL recently. That's partially the result of the products I'm using but the results look good to my eye and the faster speed is welcomed (and my computer can render Iray fairly quickly). I use both would be interested in a Iray to 3DL converter.
I would definitely buy an Iray-to-3DL shader converter.
...the ability to use a number of "in render" effects and tools which can minimse the need for postwork including:
● AoA's Grass and Rock Shaders.
● AoA"s Atmospheric Cameras (which offer greater contol over effects)
● AoA SSS Base and Toon Shaders.
● Visual Style Shaders
● Gathering Moss Shaders
● HeroFX lighting effects
● Garibaldi Express and LAMH (true hair created will work in Iray but requires conversion first, not needed in 3DL and thus renders fasster)
● Nerd3Ds effects tools (Fog Tool Deluxe, Let it Snow Tool, The Rain Tool, Smoke Dust Tool, Footsteps Tool).
● PW Sketch.
Good news :)
Getting some brilliant ideas for promos here.
I don't use IRAY and don't know of its capabilities, so this suggestion might be moot, but you'd probably make a lot more money making a 3Delight-to-IRAY convertor. Consider the 18 or so years of basic Poser and 3delight shader products that were released prior to IRAY which many DAZ customers own but wish would look fantastic in IRAY. Maybe those old product shaders look fine in IRAY and this is a deadend suggestion. Plus it'd make the entire DAZ catalog IRAY ready.
I'm a 3Delight user long-term, but I know use 3DL users are a tiny customer base compared to the IRAY base.
The Daz Default IrayUber shader does a reasonably decent job of changing most 3DL non-specialty shaders to Iray. Much of the additional work required is not really a one click solution, because there are too many variables.
And as someone who prefers 3DL myself, I'd love an Iray to 3DL converter, and as long as the timing works out right (read: there's enough mad money available upon release) I'll be only to happy to purchase this once it's available. I'm a big fan of the old pwEffect and pwGhost shaders. (I tried making a Pepper's Ghost in Iray and could not get it looking right.) And while my forays into Toon are rare, I do dabble and 3DL is far superior to Iray for such things.
In 3Delight, use displacement maps even on low poly objects. Iray needs seriously high resolution mesh density to deliver similar results.
The displacement thing is pretty huge. 3Delight also has the concept of fantom with UberSurface, allowing objects to be invisible to the camera but visible to cast shadows and be raytraced. This makes offscreen shadowcaster products, for instance, much easier.
3delight lights are not "physically correct," but this also means you don't have to massively turn them up higher when they are further from your subjects. Lighting in Iray is a constant recalculation for this reason. In 3delight it's not.
There are some weird things you can do with Iray that push it to the edge of 'realism,' like negative lights and ghost lights. But yeah.
Very definitely interested in an Iray->3DL conveter. Am still dragging my feet over Iray, but there are progressively more items in the store which use Iray only. Would like the option of using them in situations I'm acustomed to back.
Very definitely interested in an Iray->3DL conveter. Am still dragging my feet over Iray, but there are progressively more items in the store which use Iray only. Would like the option of using them in situations I'm acustomed to back.
3DL goodies ? be still my heart!
I like the way you can stop items from casting shadows when rendering in 3dl.
3delight also doesn't choke so hard on lighting dark scenes like iray does.
...same here as more and more products (even Daz Originals and PC+ items) are being released with Iray shaders only so there is more need for the "reverse". 3DL may be taking a back seat to Iray, however it still has tonnes of potential and is far more versatile with regards to different syles that can be achieved in the render pass.
Not everyone wants to do photo real rendering as is evidenced by the number of Iray works I am seeing that are postworked in Photoshop, Gimp or PSP to not look so "photoreal".
..what First Bastion said as well.
For example trying to get a proper looking "tweed" texture to render in Iray and I have to keep fiddling with the displacement, test rendering, fiddling, test rendering... until I get what looks right. So far, it still looks like grey felt.
This is kind of tricky to search for—could someone post a link to a 3DL product that uses displacement very well? Something man-made would be best, even if its rough stone. Hopefully its something I already have. I suppose it could be a new product that has materials for both.
...this is one I like to use a lot.
http://www.daz3d.com/shades-of-life-urban-construct
Render out a Z-depth pass that accounts for transparency maps used (Iray's cutout is based solely on geometry).
- Greg