Computer failure. Solved. Now playing with 1070 ti!
AnotherUserName
Posts: 2,727
So something in the computer died today (no, not a rat). Im currently assuming that it was the video card that died because it happened while a render was cooking. The screen froze with all sorts of artifacts all over the screen and the thing wouldnt restart by itself. Hard booted it (oh joy) and windows will not start. Ran the diagnostic and the hardware and memory all checked out. Im currently in safe mode and thankfully, nothing was lost from the looks of it.
Im now trying to figure out what has failed. Anyone have some pointers for what I should look for?
Thanks.
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Which OS? Which brand, HP, Dell, etc. How old a machine is it? Can you find a diagnostic app in the "Start" menu?
Since you say you're in "Safe" mode I'm assuming you have at least some sort of graphic software running. Do you know which "F" key (F2, F11, F12, etc.) starts your recovery options? (depends on the OS & brand, & age).
During the start up phase when the first light hits the screen you usually see a manufacturer's logo and usually at the bottom of that screen is a brief listing of some of the "F" key functions.
Have you tried continuing to boot to full mode from within "Safe" mode? If so, what happened?
Do you have a separate video graphics card? Does the system also have a graphics chip on the motherboard (i.e. do you have two video output sockets that are not on the same card)?
Sorry for all the questions but I'm trying to throw away a lot of the hay to get closer to the needle.
Windows 8.1, Dell_Alienware. Probably about 5 years old now. I ran the diagnostics from the setup menu (F12) and everything checked out fine. I ran dxdiag from safe mode and it did not recognize the video card, only the onboard chip. Is that because I was in safe mode or should the dxdiag still pick up the video card?
I havent tried full boot from safe mode. Ill give that a shot.
"Sorry for all the questions but I'm trying to throw away a lot of the hay to get closer to the needle".
No worries,
, I shouldnt have been so vague.
If you are in safe mode that means you are using vga drivers.
If you going into the BIOS on boot (usually ESC or F2 or F12) then navigate in just BIOS until you find where it has detected your video card. If it's not in there you video card is probably broken.
Would it be listed under the SATA Port devices?
Well, I looked through my bios and didnt see the card listed anywere. Oh well. I turned it off.
Good thing I was planning on a new card anyhow. Probably still have to wait for a couple months.
Thanks for the help.
I guess I can always go back to sculpting while I wait.
No, SATA is things like storage devices.
If you didn't change where your video cable is connected to after your screen artifacts when you booted to Safe Mode your video card should still work. Turn if off overnight & start it in the morning. Soon as you boot, reinstall the latest video drivers. Sometimes a bug in the driver code can cause those artifacts it doesn't have to be a broken video card.
It's your power supply.
What? Not enough steady power?
How do I install from safe mode? I cant connect to the internet...
Is there some way I can test that? Can I confirm that in the bios or something?
Artifacts and black screens are almost always the power supply. Power supplies degrade over time. They output less and less watts. The OP said it's at least 5 years old. When rendering, the video card uses a lot more power. So it may be at the limit of what it can supply. Extended use at that limit will eventually fail. And when it does, you either get artifacts or a black screen (black screen is better since the system essentially shuts down to protect your computer).
Anyways, in my experience and I've seen this lots of times, it's almost always the power supply. Now, I've seen video cards be damaged this way, but it looks like they were able to reboot into safe mode. So it should be fine. If it's not the power supply, I'd be very surprised.
If I knew the CPU, video card and wattage of the power supply, I could get a better idea on how likely this is.
The one other possibility is that the video card overheated, but all newer cards have thermal throttling. Still worth checking that the fan on the video card is working, preferably in another machine. The fan will only start up after using the GPU somewhat (like a render or video game).
Not a diagnosis, just sharing my experience, my last system, had video malfunction, I got black screen of death, no bios, windows, nothing, bad video card.
Several years back, I had computer failure as OP describes, artifacts/black screen, but my screen also flickered, turned out to be a bad Gigabyte mobo. Best thing to do is, have a tech shop diagnose. We have a computer store in the area, that does free diagnostics. Search around your area, Good luck.
The video card is a gtx 770, the power supply is an 850 watt, the cpu is an i7-5820k.
...that PSU should have been more than able to handle those loads.
Maximum Card power: 230w Recommended power supply: 600w
Maximum CPU power: 140w
You didn't say if you changed the video cable from your gtx video card video port to the intel HD Graphics video port.
??? So which is it ???
If you did not change video ports and the vga video is working in safe mode that means almost certainly when you boot in normal mode than your GTX vide card will work normally again. You'll be any to connect to the intenet to download new drivers if you need to but you probably won't need to.
If you did change video ports and are using the intel HD Graphics integrated video card then you need to boot in Safe Mode with Networking. That's an option, but before you do that switch back to your GTX video card port and try to boot all the up to normal mode and see if your video card is working.
Weird artifacts on the screen when it froze could either be driver issues, or a graphics issue. That it was during a render adds weight, but you're in safe mode, whilst still using the same card?
Not as likely to be the card if that is the case.
It could be a lot of things. Motherboard problems, hard drive failure (especially since you said Windows wouldn't start), GPU failure, power supply, software, etc.
Rule #1 of troubleshooting: Simplify and isolate. And don't jump to conclusions. Disconnect all unnecessary stuff and start your machine as simple as possible. If you have onboard graphics, remove the GPU and see if you can boot into Windows. Also keep in mind it could be something that comes and goes, like a failing hard drive. Sometimes it works, sometimes it doesn't. Do you have power, and stuff seems to be working?
I wouldn't assume, for example, that it has to be the power supply. It could be a lot of things. And power supplies don't necessarily put out less power when they fail. More likely they will lose a capacitor (short) or something and they won't put out any voltage. The only way to find out is to remove stuff and get as simple as possible and see what works, and start troubleshooting the basics using measuring tools, not speculation.
Oh. No I didnt change any of the cables. Ok, ill turn on the pc this morning and see what happens.
Power supplies have interlocks in the circuit that disable the power supply if the power supply connector plugs are disconnected. The quickest way to test a power supply is with a "power supply tester" device like this https://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=9SIABG95502625&cm_re=power_supply_tester-_-1W9-0005-00196-_-Product You disconnect the PS connectors and plug its motherboard connector into the device. It will provides the interlock connections and then its lights and display indicators light up to indicate if all the voltages are present and within specified range. However, cheap ones don't indicate how much current each voltage lead is able to deliver, but it does at least indicate that the various voltages are present and within the acceptible range. That gives you a warm fuzzy feeling about your PS not being toast.
You can test you PS voltages without a tester device and using only a standard volt meter but you have to know the pin layout and access the wires with the connector still plugged into the motherboard, and know what you're doing.
It could be your video card but I don't know any way to prove it apart from fitting a new card.
I had a problem with my Alienware a while ago. Mine is probably a bit older than yours, I could start it in safe mode but it just froze when I went to normal mode. I tried running diagnostics and didn't find any fault so I thought it was a software problem. I re-installed Windows, everything was OK until I installed drivers for the graphics card and it froze again. After trying different versions of the drivers I decided to take a chance with new graphics card and that fixed the problem. So now my computer is working again and I've got a graphics card that can do Iray renders (although I only risked a fairly low cost card so it's a bit limited).
I don't know much about the hardware side of computers. I assume that my old card was damaged in some way that let it work OK in VGA mode but failed when I activated it's more advanced features. Doe that sound feasible to any hardware experts reading this?
The main problem is when the diagnostics won't run because of the fault you can't pin down the problem. I don't think my computer has a video chip on the motherbaord to confuse things. One thing you could try is to de-install the video driver for your card and see if you can run normal windows mode with your video card in VGA mode. If you can that means everything else is probably OK. If re-installing drivers for the video card breaks things that points at a problem with the video card, although this probably will increase the amount of power taken from the PSU.
Remove it and use the onboard video. If all works, then start looking into the GPU as a problem.
I turned it on this morning and had the same issues. Next Ill take out the card and see if it runs on the onboard chip. Ill try to get to that today but might have to wait until tomorrow. Ill update.
Thanks everyone for the help.
As far as I know if you have onboard video then you don't need to remove the card. Just plug your monitor into the onboard plug. It should override the card.
Some designs disable the onboard video chip if a separate video card is plugged into the bus.
When looking for the needle it's best to first remove the unnecessary parts of the haystack. You'll need keyboard, mouse, display, motherboard and its onboard video chip(if it has one).
Your PSU is one of those electrical components that can literally become "ill" and die slowly, giving you some forewarning of its impending demise.
In my recent experience with an old used HP compaq
the Green indicator light comes on slowly instead of instantly
like on a "healthy" PSU.
Of course we are all merely speculating
Is there a local PC hardware shop where you can take it for a proper offline dignostic??
well a driver update once gave me black screens and rolling it back in safemode fixed it
it was Nvidia's fault, many had the issue and their forum went nuts
I always keep a copy of an older driver from NVIDIA. One that worked properly cause they have a habit of putting out bad drivers. At one point it was every other one That I had to reinstall an old driver.
nVidia has been putting out bad drivers since the 90s.
If the computer boots up ok again after waiting a hour or so, then the video card probably overheated.
The only thing you can do is wait.
Reasons for overheated card:
- Bad airflow. Or not enough fans.
- Bad fan. Check to see if all fans are spinning.
The most important fan is the fan on your graphics card. If it's not spinning, then the heat will kill your card permanently within 20 minutes.